1. Like the site? Help us keep it running! For $5 you can help keep the site running smoothly and disable ads for life. The site is funded by donations like this and minimal ad revenue: Click here to donate $5. Thank you!

Privileged or Agendered?

Discussion in 'Agender/Non-Binary/Fluid' started by Steve Gerent, Nov 18, 2019.  |  Print Topic

Support the site and hide ads for life for $5. Click here to donate.

Watchers:
This thread is being watched by 4 users.
  1. Steve Gerent

    Steve Gerent Consistently Confused

    Joined:
    Nov 18, 2019
    Messages:
    5
    Location:
    DFW, Texas
    Ratings:
    +7 / 0 / -0
    Hey, I'm Steve,
    I didn't do the whole, "introduce yourself" thing, because I don't really feel like I fit into the LGBTQA+ community.
    I just...don't care about gender. You can call me "he, she, they, etc," and the most you'll get is a raised eyebrow. Not due to "that's not who I am" but more of a "really? That's what you see? a'ight, sure". I've had a friend, while opening up about stuff, call me "gurl" and if anything, I took it as a compliment. They were seeing me as a person to open up to, and not as a male/female, etc.

    I'm just not sure if my apathy about gender is due to me being born in a sex that was comfortable to me, or due to an actual difference in my psychology. Since I was born into a sex where I was comfortable, and the gender assigned to me wasn't a big deal. I dunno if it actually matters.

    I've thought multiple times how'd it be easier for me (due to a variety of societal expectations) to be a woman, but in the end, it really doesn't matter to me what's in my pants.

    Is this a sign of me being agendered? Or is this simply an expression of my privilege at being born someone who feels comfortable in their assigned sex/gender?
     
  2. Dreamsexual
    Tolerant

    Dreamsexual Reliable Contributor
    Beloved Member

    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2019
    Messages:
    271
    Location:
    South West UK
    Ratings:
    +282 / 0 / -0
    I'm not sure I can tell from that description either! :) 

    Gender is a complex and multi-faceted thing, a right old mix of elements.

    Off the top of my head, I'd have initially thought that people who have no internal disconnect between their body, voice, mannerisms or common expression and their internal psychological sense of self would be cis (or maybe a very lucky androgyne).

    But if we introduce the idea of agender as a possibility it is not so clear.

    Maybe ask yourself some questions, like: if tomorrow you woke up with a pronounced female body, voice, mannerisms and wardrobe, and knew that the change was forever permanent and irreversible, would you be happy, sad, relieved, annoyed, unmoved, dismiss it as irrelevant, etc.

    Or, if you could be so physically perfectly androgynous that you could 'pass' for either with no effort depending upon your fancy would you prefer that to now?

    Also, I think you may be confusing agender with asexuality - they're very different :) . One is about gender, one about sexuality. Ask if you're unsure.
     
    #2 Dreamsexual, Nov 18, 2019
    Last edited: Nov 18, 2019
  3. Steve Gerent

    Steve Gerent Consistently Confused

    Joined:
    Nov 18, 2019
    Messages:
    5
    Location:
    DFW, Texas
    Ratings:
    +7 / 0 / -0
    I am very much not asexual. I mistakenly put "asexual" in the title, that's on me. I've fixed that now. I'm...I guess the best word would be gynophillic, where I'm attracted to femininity, regardless of sex. Which is another layer of confusion on whether or not I would classify as agendered. I am a sexual person. I think I fall in the "soft A" category, mostly likely demisexual, but that's a different discussion.

    If I woke up in a female body tomorrow, and nothing else would change, I would be slightly disappointed, as I would like biological children at some point, but I'm attracted to women for the most part. I don't know if I'd be comfortable wearing dresses, but I feel like that's more of a social constraint rather than a psychological one. IE, the idea of wearing a kilt isn't as odd. If anything it would be exciting, as it's such a different experience from what I've lived through all of my life previously

    The idea of being androgynous, honestly, would make me more uncomfortable than being completely passing for male or female. Mostly due to the fear that people would ask me "so, uh, are you a boy or a girl" and I just wouldn't want to interact with a stranger on that level.

    I've tried to see if I could "pass" as androgynous, just via voice, using audacity and my own personal subjectivity, and there is no way that I could ever pass for androgynous. My manner of speaking and tone of voice is far too masculine, at least from my perspective. That kinda double back to the main question of "privileged or agendered?"
    I have no fear of being misgendered, and that might add something, I dunno.
     
  4. Dreamsexual
    Tolerant

    Dreamsexual Reliable Contributor
    Beloved Member

    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2019
    Messages:
    271
    Location:
    South West UK
    Ratings:
    +282 / 0 / -0
    I'm gynophillic too! High-five on that :) 

    It's interesting that you'd experience no internal loss of self with a wholesale sex change, just some concern over a practical issue. I don't think that someone who was 'fully cis' would be so blasé. So that might be a hint.

    Again, with the expression (wearing dresses), it seems the 'social constraint' (what people will think, say and do?) is the real concern for you rather than a clash with your internal sense of self. That too strikes me as a bit of a hint, since I don't think cis people would be so ok with dressing as another gender/sex. You might want to try some experimentation at home alone - thus avoiding the social issues - and see how you feel in make-up or a dress etc. Sometimes the act can reveal more of how you actually feel than just thought experiment.

    It's hard for me to say more. It might just be you're a very comfortable-in-your-own-skin, very robust, very liberal cis guy - which is cool and wonderful! Or it might be that you are somewhat agender or something similar, which is also cool and wonderful!

    I suspect it's gonna take time, experimentation, conversation, thought and information to work out. And I hope that journey is a good one for you :) 
     
  5. Steve Gerent

    Steve Gerent Consistently Confused

    Joined:
    Nov 18, 2019
    Messages:
    5
    Location:
    DFW, Texas
    Ratings:
    +7 / 0 / -0
    It doesn't help that a dress just would not fit my body type. I would not look good in a dress. Skirt, maybe (going back to the kilt thing), but a dress would be a disaster. No one wants to see that.

    I was in theatre when I was younger, so I've tried (stage) makeup before, although a bit different from day-to-day makeup. It was kinda fun, in a way, like painting.

    It's just...I dunno, I'm just me, regardless of what you call me. My main concern is essentially intruding on LGBTQA...+ spaces being a passing cis straight white male. I can't shake the feeling that my disregard for gender is just an expression of privilege, and not of honest-to-god agenderness.

    But, at the same time, it's hard for me to disregard that what pronouns people use have no impact on my comfort level. They/them, he/him, she/her, have no effect on me. As long as I know you're referring to me, its nbd.

    Also, Dreamsexual, you might want to change your "mood" icon, because I've seen how active you are here, and you are most definitely not a lurker. :p 
     
  6. Dreamsexual
    Tolerant

    Dreamsexual Reliable Contributor
    Beloved Member

    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2019
    Messages:
    271
    Location:
    South West UK
    Ratings:
    +282 / 0 / -0
    He, he ... didn't even know the mood icon was a thing - will do :) 

    I wouldn't worry about 'intruding' into some LGBT+ community thing. At least, I personally wouldn't pay it much heed. As far as I'm concerned pretty much all gender and sexuality identities are valid and to be celebrated as part of the rich tapestry of the human condition - and that includes whatever you are, even if you don't know yourself :) 

    Questioning and exploring are important, and if you can't do it safely amongst the 'alphabet people' (lol), then where can you do it?
     
  7. Corvus
    Chatty

    Corvus Agender chatterbox
    Premium Supporter Beloved Member

    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2019
    Messages:
    1,081
    Location:
    Netherlands
    Ratings:
    +1,289 / 0 / -0
    Hi Steve and welcome to the family. Regardless of whether you are agender or not you definitely have a place in the LGBT family...even if you discover you're just a cis straight male you are still definitely an ally although I've never seen a cis straight male with so many doubts and so far you've been checking all the agender boxes, down to what type of doubts you have. Also a big point, cis straight people care just as much about their labels as us LGBT's do, maybe even more! Go out there and call a manly man a she and you end up getting punched in the mouth; nobody is that confident in themselves that being constantly misgendered doesn't phase them...if there's no wrong pronoun for you it might be because there's no right one either and there I can help you :) 

    Being agender is difficult because there's nothing where people expect there to be something. I've joined here 2 months ago and I was also terrified of the community's reaction...after all you read heartbreaking stories about people stuck in the wrong body and others fighting for years trying to be recognised by others as their real gender and here I was casually strolling along going "Gender? What's that? That doesn't matter to me" and I feared that people would hate me for it (and trust me, some do, just not in here...this is LGBT paradise).

    I'll tell you right now, being agender is no privilege and there are very specific battles to be fought that won't get you much support out there because it's not as easily recognisable to non-LGBT (or even within the LGBT community) as say being gay or trans. It's also a bit of a rabbit hole because the world is binary, so being non-binary can feel like you're falling endlessly with nothing to grab onto. The more you realise how far removed you are from gender the more you'll feel like you don't really have a place anywhere...for the vast majority of people gender is a pillar on which they've built everything; gender comes before race, religion, culture...and agender people simply lack that pillar that connects them to other people on a fundamental level.

    I've spent 34 years thinking of myself as cis straight male and the more I realised I was none of the 3 the more difficult it got to connect to people, to the point where these forums became my main source of socialisation. Now, I'm not a hermit by any means but as cliché as this might sound, these are my people and we can be that for you too regardless of what you end up deciding.

    Sorry for the long wall of (maybe rambling) text; kind of in a hurry but wanted to answer you before I left :) 
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • Informative Informative x 1
    • List
    #7 Corvus, Nov 19, 2019
    Last edited: Nov 19, 2019
  8. Aiqe
    Creative

    Aiqe Curious Explorer
    Beloved Member

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2017
    Messages:
    57
    Ratings:
    +52 / 0 / -0
    Hey there!!
    First of all, I hope you feel very welcome here! Many people on this forum(s) search for themselves, their identity etc. Me included. I know for sure I‘m pan/bi but I‘m not at all sure about my gender identity. Somewhere between agender or maybe fluid. At the moment, I‘m okay with just not having figured it out yet. I‘d call myself genderqueer, that fits for me.
    What bothers me are people who directly assume I‘m a straight cis female just bc I have a boyfriend (who‘s also not straight btw). Seeing me or my partner alone, people tend to think we could be queer. But at the very moment they see us together - vanished.
    You already listen to yourself and that‘s great! Listen more and try to figure out if you‘re okay with people calling you cis or if you prefer being called agender/ fluid/ genderqueer/ ... whatever label you like :) 
    Good luck and welcome!
     
  9. Steve Gerent

    Steve Gerent Consistently Confused

    Joined:
    Nov 18, 2019
    Messages:
    5
    Location:
    DFW, Texas
    Ratings:
    +7 / 0 / -0
    Thanks, everybody, I really appreciate the kind words. I dunno if I'll ever really embrace the "agender" label, but that's definitely the closest thing out of all the other labels that I feel right now. I just kinda started out really questioning my identity, even if how I felt hasn't actually changed. In any case, I hope to look around and see different points of view.
     

Support the site and hide ads for life for $5. Click here to donate.

Share This Page